mixed breed?

[boeh]

Originally Posted by drache

my daughter is a hybrid

Like Stefan said.

Originally Posted by drache

the whole bloodline is going to go extinct
while I'm not fond of hybrids (the very word makes me think of garish corns), I also think racial purity is a human concept and not a law of nature

Not the whole bloodline, but it can happen that a high percentage of the animals are getting mixed. In case of a large breeder, it could make a lot of problems.

The problem that I have is the following. Have a look at T. s. tetrataenia. There are only a few in the nature left, they'll probably not survive in nature. When we now start to mix them up with infernalis (some do that already), maybe we lose the "natural" speciem. Our grandchilds could probably only have a look at clean tetrataenias in a book?

It's a extreme example, that's right, but if to many people start to mix, it could really get a problem. And that's why I don't like such snake hybrids, and hope that hybrids in the speciem Thamnophis will be avoided. It always can happen, and I don't want to blame someone because of that, but I hope that people just try to prevent.

Cyrill

[adamanteus]

I can't see why people choose to hybridize, when it isn't necessary. I really fail to see the attraction. I know hybrids occur in nature, but I prefer to keep my snakes true to type.

[Stefan-A]

I guess it's a matter of preference.

[adamanteus]

Originally Posted by Stefan-A

I guess it's a matter of preference.

Indeed. I wouldn't condemn anyone else for it. It's just not for me.

[Serpentine99]

Well the hybrid thing is the developing human instinct to change the world around them, just as we make tools to prevent hard work, we use the same instinct for our enjoyment. Also the owning animals is another human trait altogether. As we become more ignorant of the word survival, we tend to see certain animals,(perhaps all) as just changeable playthings.

PS: I know it sounds cruel, but hey, we're only human.

[drache]

Originally Posted by Serpentine99

As we become more ignorant of the word survival, we tend to see certain animals,(perhaps all) as just changeable playthings.

I think that's what troubles me most about hybridization - the sense that people are regarding animals as toys or fashion accessories
that attitude I find more "dangerous" than the sullying of a bloodline
I tend to be much more critical of what people do to animals than of what animals do.

[boeh]

Originally Posted by drache

...the sense that people are regarding animals as toys or fashion accessories
that attitude I find more "dangerous" than the sullying of a bloodline
I tend to be much more critical of what people do to animals than of what animals do...

That's a generel problem - but I agree, this is more dangerous. People do that since a long time with dogs, cats, and so on. But they have reached a several limit on those species. "New developments" (ugly word in this context) are regressive. So a new "field" is needed...and was found everywhere in the animality

Futhermore, as crazy as it sounds, this is one of the less painful things that humans force to animals. We got other, more bestial problems.

[Stefan-A]

Let's not get carried away here, we're all pretty much treating animals as if they are toys. That's what pets (or whatever you want to call animals that are kept for other reasons than production) essentially are. We don't play with them like a child would do with a toy, but we are keeping them for the same psychological stimulation. The difference between those that produce hybrids and those who don't is so small, that it's in my opinion no point in condemning them on the grounds that they regard animals as playthings. They take their hobby one tiny step further.

In my opinion. Nobody has to agree.

[boeh]

Sounds good, but I only partial agree. In my opinion there are people that are straining the thing to much. They're trying to breed animals that are systematically seen, far away from each other. Without caring about the health of the snakes (yes, some of them die in course of those treatment), and there I make a difference to me.

But your right, this ain't a thing of hybridization, much more with how you deal with other animals.

[drache]

the difference may be small and perhaps I put too much value on caring
there are persons who are curious and fascinated and experience animals as a source of wonder and learning and while this implies the same amount of self-centeredness as that of a person who feels they look cool with a big snake draped over their physique (particularly one that matches their boots), I do believe there to be a qualitative difference
being somewhat of a failure at maintaining a regular meditation practice, I've not been able to overcome my preferences
so I prefer the curious person over the big-snake-makes-me-cool person
and I prefer animals in their "natural" state, but beyond certain loose parameters, I can't say I know what exactly that is
it's just a construct anyway