I am still around

[Lori P]

If my mice ever really breed, lol, I have no doubt at some point I'll feed live pinks too. I just had never thought about the fact that garters just kind of swallow, without constricting first. Quess I never had cause to ponder it before... tho I should have realized by watching them eat fish. Yeah, hope the pinks pass quickly.

[Stefan-A]

Originally Posted by Bay_area

Never see them move once they are down...LOL! I am sure they die right away.

Probably too tight to move in there.. or to inhale.

[ssssnakeluvr]

wanderings have been known to throw a coil or two around mice....mainly to hold them while eating....their saliva also acts like a tranquilizer on mice.

[Stefan-A]

Originally Posted by ssssnakeluvr

wanderings have been known to throw a coil or two around mice....mainly to hold them while eating....their saliva also acts like a tranquilizer on mice.

I think I read somewhere that they're probably the most venomous garter.. And garter venom is neurotoxic.

And according to somebody, it's real constriction. I don't know, I'm still looking for scientific articles on both subjects.

But I still have the picture of the vagrans constricting/restraining a mouse and it might just be my imagination, but their enlarged teeth seem bigger than the ones on my sirtalis. And they definitely feel a lot stronger than sirtalis when you handle them. In my humble opinion.

[Stefan-A]

http://links.jstor.org/sici?sici=002...rigin=crossref

Abstract

Western terrestrial garter snakes (Thamnophis elegans) are the only Thamnophis known to constrict prey, and previous studies suggest that they are relatively inefficient constrictors. To quantitatively evaluate that perception, we compared the constricting behavior of T. elegans to that of a more typical constrictor, the gopher snake, Pituophis catenifer. We recorded the behavior of snakes preying upon mice under controlled laboratory conditions, focusing on behavioral measures related to the function of efficiently subduing and ingesting prey. Compared to gopher snakes, western terrestrial garter snakes showed the following characteristics indicating they are relatively inefficient constrictors: (1) greater variability in the method of applying constricting coils; (2) a weaker tendency to constrict prey; (3) longer times to subdue prey; (4) a lower frequency of trials in which coils were parallel; and (5) absence of the behavior of releasing the initial bite on the prey prior to the initiation of swallowing. These differences between the two species might be a result of differences in recent selective regimes, because western terrestrial garter snakes rely less heavily than gopher snakes on prey for which constriction is likely to reduce a snake's feeding costs. Another, not mutually exclusive, explanation for the behavioral differences is that they reflect the more recent evolutionary origin of constriction in T. elegans than in P. catenifer. Despite their relative inefficiency, the Colorado T. elegans used in this study nearly always killed the mice they constricted prior to ingesting them. In contrast, previous studies have indicated that T. elegans from the Pacific Northwest rarely kill mice they constrict. This difference may represent intraspecific geographic variation in constricting behavior. However, a recent molecular systematic study suggests that Colorado and Pacific Northwest T. elegans may represent distinct species in which constriction has independently evolved.

Bolded some parts that I found especially interesting.

[Bay_area]

Originally Posted by Stefan-A

I think I read somewhere that they're probably the most venomous garter.. And garter venom is neurotoxic.

I have heard that too. The mice are dead by the time he is finished eating, so there maybe something to that

[Bay_area]

The Coast Garter was still looking hungry today, so I gave him a couple more mice...gone in seconds

[Loren]

My coast garter is a voracious eater too. I tossed a peach fuzzy at it the other day, it glanced off the hidebox, and I swear she(?) caught it before it hit the substrate.
I have read that many snake species have been discovered or susupected to have mildly venomous saliva.
I noticed a few years ago that live fence lizards seldom struggled much when my long nose snake would bite them. Always wondered if something in their saliva might stun prey as well.

[Lori P]

You did get some good shots there, Jerry- and he really is a gorgeous snake. What is the other garter in with the coast?

[Bay_area]

Originally Posted by Lori P

What is the other garter in with the coast?

That is just the California Redsided Garter, he will not eat the mice. He likes minnows though