San Francisco Garter Snake - Page 3

CrazyHedgehog · 11-20-2007, 04:47 PM

are you allowed them in Canada?

anji1971 · 11-20-2007, 05:41 PM

Where I live, technically no, not in the city itself. But the bylaws out in the county allow it, and we do wish to move out there someday. Not to mention how many people in the city are keeping exotics despite the bylaw.

i of the storm · 11-21-2007, 11:51 AM

can you buy/keep them in the US?

Cazador · 11-21-2007, 12:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by i of the storm

can you buy/keep them in the US?

Nah, they're on the endangered species list... dangerously rare in the wild.

i of the storm · 11-21-2007, 05:08 PM

Since its a subspecies, basically just a color difference, couldn't a population be created elsewhere, like on an island?

Stefan-A · 11-21-2007, 05:20 PM

No. The island has its own unique ecosystem and enough islands in the Pacific have already been damaged that way, but due to Boiga irregularis. They've spread with cargo ships and planes from island to island since the mid-1900's and they've had a serious impact on the local wildlife. The island of Guam is the most famous example, I guess.

I'm just saying that we already have a warning example.

Cazador · 11-21-2007, 09:09 PM

J,

You're bringing up the issue of a reintroduction program. I think the Europeans have proven their immense success breeding captive tetrataenia, but in order to do so in the U.S., one would need to be federally permitted, which isn't being allowed. Stephan makes a great counter-arguement. The threat is that the immune system of captive tetrataenia becomes compromised, and sick captives get released and intermingle with the few remaining wild ones. Then they become the death of the entire subspecies. A carefully-selected island seems to have merit, but the feds just don't take chances after a (sub)species has been added to the Endangered Species List. I think responsible professionals could pull if off, though. What's even more strange is that the feds allow a very limited number to be captured in order for scientific research, but captive breeding and reintroduction remains one GIANT step away. I have to admit, though, that I believe it would be extremely risky for a well-intentioned hobbiest to illegally give it a try.

Rick

KITKAT · 11-23-2007, 03:41 PM

In Ohio, we had a variety of Plains garter that lived only in a certain natural preserve. ODNR introduced some western Plains garters into the area to try to bolster the population.

They also had a breed and reintroduce program to try to spread the species further.

Result? They are now extremely rare, even in the small area where they were once plentiful.

Miserable failure.

11-20-2007, 04:47 PM	#21 (permalink)
CrazyHedgehog "Fourth shed In Progress" Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 783 Country:	Re: San Francisco Garter Snake are you allowed them in Canada? __________________ Inge our house is like a zoo, too many to list here!

11-20-2007, 05:41 PM	#22 (permalink)
anji1971 Finder of unique Garters Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Windsor, Ontario Posts: 2,225 Country:	Re: San Francisco Garter Snake Where I live, technically no, not in the city itself. But the bylaws out in the county allow it, and we do wish to move out there someday. Not to mention how many people in the city are keeping exotics despite the bylaw. __________________ Anji

11-21-2007, 11:51 AM	#23 (permalink)
i of the storm "Preparing For First shed" Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 55 Country:	Re: San Francisco Garter Snake can you buy/keep them in the US?

11-21-2007, 05:08 PM	#25 (permalink)
i of the storm "Preparing For First shed" Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 55 Country:	Re: San Francisco Garter Snake Since its a subspecies, basically just a color difference, couldn't a population be created elsewhere, like on an island?

11-21-2007, 05:20 PM	#26 (permalink)
Stefan-A The Prince of Insufficient Light. Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Southern Finland Posts: 4,957 Country:	Re: San Francisco Garter Snake No. The island has its own unique ecosystem and enough islands in the Pacific have already been damaged that way, but due to Boiga irregularis. They've spread with cargo ships and planes from island to island since the mid-1900's and they've had a serious impact on the local wildlife. The island of Guam is the most famous example, I guess. I'm just saying that we already have a warning example. __________________ No cutesy.

11-21-2007, 09:09 PM	#27 (permalink)
Cazador Moderator Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Alaska, USA Posts: 1,608 Country:	Re: San Francisco Garter Snake J, You're bringing up the issue of a reintroduction program. I think the Europeans have proven their immense success breeding captive tetrataenia, but in order to do so in the U.S., one would need to be federally permitted, which isn't being allowed. Stephan makes a great counter-arguement. The threat is that the immune system of captive tetrataenia becomes compromised, and sick captives get released and intermingle with the few remaining wild ones. Then they become the death of the entire subspecies. A carefully-selected island seems to have merit, but the feds just don't take chances after a (sub)species has been added to the Endangered Species List. I think responsible professionals could pull if off, though. What's even more strange is that the feds allow a very limited number to be captured in order for scientific research, but captive breeding and reintroduction remains one GIANT step away. I have to admit, though, that I believe it would be extremely risky for a well-intentioned hobbiest to illegally give it a try. Rick

11-23-2007, 03:41 PM	#28 (permalink)
KITKAT Old and wise snake Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 898 Country:	Re: San Francisco Garter Snake In Ohio, we had a variety of Plains garter that lived only in a certain natural preserve. ODNR introduced some western Plains garters into the area to try to bolster the population. They also had a breed and reintroduce program to try to spread the species further. Result? They are now extremely rare, even in the small area where they were once plentiful. Miserable failure. __________________ KitKat "Acts of kindness should never be random."

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