Please Identify

[Lisa4john]

I'll just have to try, the other one has already eaten. I'll keep praying and trying...

[Lisa4john]

Nice looking snake, thanks for sharing. He looks almost like a concinnus, but not quite such bold spots... to my untrained eyes anyway.

[i_heart_sneakie_snakes]

What a beautiful little baby!!! Hope it gets to eating for you

[Lisa4john]

Thanks, this is not one that has tried to eat yet. I got 3 that day actually, all pugets. One has already eaten 2 pieces of worm, one yesterday and one today, the one today was actually taken from the tongs, I was so excited. The other poor lil gal tried to eat a piece of worm tonight, but it was too big and she gagged it up again. Then she didn't want anything to do with any other pieces; she would have to take the biggest piece of the pie! Sigh, I hope that doesn't scare her from eating anything now. Only time will tell. As soon as I get my camera phone hooked up to the pc I'll get some pix up to show you my new babies.

[katach]

So glad they are settling in for you! They sure are pretty! What names did you guys settle on for the other two. The one with the dark belly was sure a sweet girl.

[Lisa4john]

The dark belly, thin stripe is Black Beauty, Beauty for short. And my son called the other one Samantha, cuz he was afraid we would have to release Sam and Turq. So with that I'm calling Sam, Sage now cuz of his belly color. I almost let them go yesterday but decided to try to brumate Sam (Sage) first to give him the most opportunity and so I know I did everything I could do for him before I give up on him.

[ConcinusMan]

Nice looking snake, thanks for sharing. He looks almost like a concinnus, but not quite such bold spots... to my untrained eyes anyway.

Yes, very close. But the two subspecies are nearly identical on a genetic level so its not surprising. Some populations even share specific genes or genetic markers with populations of concinnus' many miles to the south. In short, at some point in the recent past, they were one. Nothing more than geographic morph variations of the same snake, now geographically separated and evolving separately.

[EasternGirl]

I thought concinnus when I first saw the pics too. She is lovely! Very nice find.

[Lisa4john]

I thought concinnus when I first saw the pics too. She is lovely! Very nice find.

Thanks! Yeah, me too, but I knew they were not usual for this area.

[ConcinusMan]

I thought concinnus when I first saw the pics too. She is lovely! Very nice find.

To the untrained eye I suppose. This is why I see so many snakes for sale, particularly infernalis, parietalis, concinnus, fitchi, or any other garter with red spots, being misidentified as one or the other when its not. Even worse, this leads to hybrids which are then sold as one of those snakes.

To clarify, red pugets have puget facial markings, darker black, and a different shade of orange. If I showed that snake side by side with a similar snake of a different subspecies, the differences would be quite obvious. Just like a laterally striped concinnus next to a fitchi. Yes, very similar but the colors are different as well as other visual clues.

Time and time again I see people calling red pugets, "valley garters"