[quote=Steven@HumboldtHerps;85937]

I've gone on about this topic before, but I'd like to post a few example photos here to show my frustration with the gestalt of some of these snakes. First, Stefan-A, I understand T. e. terrestris has been absorbed by T. e. elegans (Great! Now the elegans clade has a whole plethora of morphs to add to its list!), but could you find me a link about this, as I would love to read it. So... "Mountain Garters" here on the coast and in our coastal ranges come in all kinds of patterns and colors, but most all the coastals have olive-green, olive-brown, light olive-tan, or near black heads.


I thought I read that terrestris was now vagrans....let me know what you find out....I am trying to look up and find out what I can also.....





So what do you think of these?







Definitely think this is fitchi....I have a male fitchi from Utah with the orange flecking on the belly....plus, being all black with the red...haven't seen a fitchi with any other background colors.... VERY nice female too!!!!! I love fitchi!!!!





may be also a fitchi.....good pic, but can't quite tell the colors well enough....







well....ooops....by looking at the neck shot.....I would say formerly terrestris.....has more greenish background colors......