Past Snakes

[Stefan-A]

Actually, I'm going to go as far as to say that he was the calmest garter I've ever seen. My female wandering garters are pretty damn mellow, but that male was even more laid-back. They'll twitch a little when you touch them, but that male wouldn't even do that.

If I could only get my male wandering garters to become that calm.

[guidofatherof5]

This is my other son. Krinkleback was only on the Ranch for about 1.5 years but has made a lasting impression on me and many of the people that came in contact with him.
My oldest daughter told me today that one of her girlfriends is going to have a picture of her and Krinckleback in the yearbook. Apparently she was in tears when she heard of his passing.
He was a good man. He may have had scoliosis but he never let it slow him down.

[Tyrel26]

Beautiful snakes everyone, its good to see so many people taking part in this post.

@ guidofatherof5, thats the first pic ive seen of krinkleback....i never realized his condition was that bad, i assume you found him that way? did the condition worsen over time?

[guidofatherof5]

@ guidofatherof5, thats the first pic ive seen of krinkleback....i never realized his condition was that bad, i assume you found him that way? did the condition worsen over time?

Here's his thread:
http://www.thamnophis.com/forum/show...ight=scoliosis

[infernalis]

lost so many over the years.....
Bye Limon, Xena, Ember, Pearl, rusty, Cheeto, brownie, cherry bear, flicka, magma, etc...
a couple dozen more with no names.....(Baby season is rough, we always lose some)

[ConcinusMan]

I've told my story before and I know I have pics in this house somewhere I can scan. I just need to find them!

I got a male and a female concinnus around 1986 when I was still in high school. They were just babies (about 10 inches long). They passed away not very many years ago. They were exceptionally old. (around 20yrs) Together they produced about 150 offspring over the few times they bred. The girl was well over 3 feet (about 45 inches) when she died. She was a gorgeous 3 striper and extremely tame and smart. He was a high-strung high black male.

This one looks a lot like her but she had more orange. She had blue/green on her face and a very blue throat too.


I do miss them terribly. I was missing them really bad and that's when I joined the forum.

[Tyrel26]

thats a long time to have a snake, you must have took great care of them (which i know from your posts)

So now i have 2 questions for you;
1. whats the longest you've heard of someone keeping a garter?
2. do you still have offspring from your original pair?

[ConcinusMan]

I know of someone (a friend) who kept a wild concinnus for 16 years. That's why I was saying mine were EXCEPTIONALLY old. I really wouldn't expect that to happen again.

They always got their cool down / reduction in daylight hours every year, even though they didn't always get full brumation (fridge) and they grew slowly. They were only allowed to bred a few times. I don't know if that makes a difference or what, but I suspect it does. They also got plenty of real direct sunlight in the summer and were fed mostly their natural wild food which I went out and collected. In a pinch, they even got fed goldfish.

In contrast, the longest I kept an ordinoides was 12 years. It was probably around 13 when it died seemingly of old age.

I do not have any offspring. At age 6 months to 3 years, all were released where I found the parents.

[Tyrel26]

thanks for the info. its pretty amazing to see how long these snakes can live in captivity but im sure the diet and close to natural conditions you kept them in is the reason. also, were there a lot of vet visits over the years for these snakes?

with regard to the different color morphs, are there any that seem shorter or longer lived than others? one can read a million papers on the subject but i feel nothing speaks the truth more so than real experience and there are exceptions to every rule of course. I have read that albino animals have a shorter life expectancy than many others, in the wild this is no doubt due to heat absorbution and predation, but i was wondering if this still stands true for the captive snakes.

if anyone else would like to add to this topic please do

thanks for reading
Tyrel

[ConcinusMan]

No vet visits. They never needed one as far as I could tell. Besides that, vets in WA and OR will not treat T.sirtalis unless it's some sort of morph such as an albino or melanistic, ghost, etc. If it looks like a wild sirtalis, they are prevented by law from treating them.

I'm sure many genes, seen and unseen can influence longevity. There's just way to know for sure what genes have what effect in this regard. Natural selection weeds out genes that do not favor survival but it's a different story in captivity. When pressures on populations change, so does the genes that are allowed to be passed on. Genes that cause "good looks" and perhaps survivability in captive conditions could certainly carry hidden effects such as smaller litters, and certainly shorter OR longer lives.

All my wild concinnus litters were very tiny babies (about 5 or 6 inches) and numbers ranged from around 20, all the way up to 50. Yet I hear that snakes in captivity, many generations removed from the wild, mostly have very small litters, but larger babies (7-10 inches). Wild genes might just be favoring larger litters due to high mortality rate. I hear wild concinnus offspring mortality rate is very high. Very few make it to breeding age.

There seems to be a lot of predator pressure on very small one's or very large one's. 90% of the concinnus I can find in the wild are right around 26 inches. Very few found are under that size, or over. I have found them over 3 feet but only on a few occasions. In those few occasions, the snake was easy to spot, and was slow. A 3 foot gravid concinnus doesn't move too well!