Guess who was smart, yert fealt stupid in the first wildlife management lab?

[ConcinusMan]

Well, the study was done on vagrans and they are known to feed heavily on rodents. In fact, in all my years of herping and seeing snakes vomit prey items, a wild vagrans last summer was the only time I've ever seen a garter vomit up a rodent. They're also (wild vagrans from that area) the only garters I've ever fed in captivity that I've observed to actually coil around or pin their food down. It would make sense that not all garters would necessarily be that toxic especially if their target prey is something that is much easier to subdue, such as a small frog or salamander/newt and that level of toxicity is surely not necessary for something like a northwestern that feeds heavily on worms and slugs.

[MasSalvaje]

Well, the study was done on vagrans and they are known to feed heavily on rodents. In fact, in all my years of herping and seeing snakes vomit prey items, a wild vagrans last summer was the only time I've ever seen a garter vomit up a rodent. They're also (wild vagrans from that area) the only garters I've ever fed in captivity that I've observed to actually coil around or pin their food down. It would make sense that not all garters would necessarily be that toxic especially if their target prey is something that is much easier to subdue, such as a small frog or salamander/newt and that level of toxicity is surely not necessary for something like a northwestern that feeds heavily on worms and slugs.

As I said, garter venom is much more complex than to justify the use of over arching statements that attempt to sum it all up in a single sentence or phrase, or even in a single study.

-Thomas

[KephrenJorgensen]

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