Mouse Meat and activity cycle

[aquamentus_11]

Just a few quick questions re: pinkies and garter activity cycles. I've only ever owned boas, so my experience with colubrids is extremely lacking.

Garters don't have pit organs, so I'm curious whether or not they prefer warm prey (strictly from a non-targeting, palate-preference standpoint). Their love of fish, worms and amphibians makes me think no. However, when I offered a thawed pinky piece to my 10"er the other day, she struck it, chewed for a split second then released. I know that she was eating them along with worms prior to coming to my place. As I've said in previous posts, she's probably still settling in, but the fact that she went for it then backed off made me wonder if I'm just presenting it incorrectly. I take them out of the freezer and drop them in a ziplock which I then place in hot water until the pieces thaw and warm a little. The pieces are warm-room temp when I offer them. Should they be warmer? I use a small pair of hemostats to offer food and slowly put it in front of her nose. If she doesn't go for it immediately, I back it off and make it move a bit in the foliage or wherever she is. Humidity and temps are fine, btw.

My next question is re: her activity cycle. I thought garters were supposed to be diurnal. Granted I'm not home very often during the day, but when I am, I never see her out. The only time I ever see her come out and cruise is around 6:30-7:30pm after the UVB light has turned off. Like I said, my temps and humidity are fine (72-86F daytime, 68-72F night, 40-65%). She's making me think that she's more crepuscular than anything. Also, she doesn't seem terrified of me (just conservatively distrustful) and I've never chased her to pick her up, so I don't think she's scared and hiding all day: her tank is right next to my desk and she still comes out when I'm there in the evening. When she's out, she just cruises around placidly, climbing and swimming and stopping to watch me once in awhile. Am I doing something wrong or is this normal? Maybe, being a northern species, she likes things to be cooler....though ambient T is usually hanging around the mid to upper 70's. I'll stay home all this weekend to see if she comes out mid-morning, too. Until then, any sage advice from the more experienced? She's a lot of fun otherwise; I just hope I'm not making things hard on her.

[gregmonsta]

Just a few quick questions re: pinkies and garter activity cycles. I've only ever owned boas, so my experience with colubrids is extremely lacking.

Garters don't have pit organs, so I'm curious whether or not they prefer warm prey (strictly from a non-targeting, palate-preference standpoint). Their love of fish, worms and amphibians makes me think no. However, when I offered a thawed pinky piece to my 10"er the other day, she struck it, chewed for a split second then released. I know that she was eating them along with worms prior to coming to my place. As I've said in previous posts, she's probably still settling in, but the fact that she went for it then backed off made me wonder if I'm just presenting it incorrectly. I take them out of the freezer and drop them in a ziplock which I then place in hot water until the pieces thaw and warm a little. The pieces are warm-room temp when I offer them. Should they be warmer? I use a small pair of hemostats to offer food and slowly put it in front of her nose. If she doesn't go for it immediately, I back it off and make it move a bit in the foliage or wherever she is. Humidity and temps are fine, btw.

My next question is re: her activity cycle. I thought garters were supposed to be diurnal. Granted I'm not home very often during the day, but when I am, I never see her out. The only time I ever see her come out and cruise is around 6:30-7:30pm after the UVB light has turned off. Like I said, my temps and humidity are fine (72-86F daytime, 68-72F night, 40-65%). She's making me think that she's more crepuscular than anything. Also, she doesn't seem terrified of me (just conservatively distrustful) and I've never chased her to pick her up, so I don't think she's scared and hiding all day: her tank is right next to my desk and she still comes out when I'm there in the evening. When she's out, she just cruises around placidly, climbing and swimming and stopping to watch me once in awhile. Am I doing something wrong or is this normal? Maybe, being a northern species, she likes things to be cooler....though ambient T is usually hanging around the mid to upper 70's. I'll stay home all this weekend to see if she comes out mid-morning, too. Until then, any sage advice from the more experienced? She's a lot of fun otherwise; I just hope I'm not making things hard on her.

I wold not offer pinkies any warmer than room temp. In fact I don't think temperature matters at all. It's more down to flavour, shape and size. I have snakes that simply don't want anything to do with pinkies if there is a choice. She's probably just not used to it as a food source without the worm scenting. Braining the pinky or putting a small cut in its belly can help.

If you're not seeing her until the UV is off then it might be worth thinking that it's too strong for her - what percentage is the UV and how far is it from the snake in the tank? Does the room she's in receive a lot of natural light?

[aquamentus_11]

I'm not offering whole pinkies yet, but I will try the scenting. I'll check the % when I get home, but the bulb is about 2' above the substrate. The tank never receives direct sunlight, but the room has windows so the lighting fluctuates throughout the day.

[Light of Dae]

Try mincing worms up n mixing them with pinky chunks in a shallow dish or lid with a little water. The way I do it is cut the pinky up while frozen, into bite size chunks(about the size of her head or little bigger) put it in the dish with little bit of luke warm water, then take out the worms n mince one or half of one up, like really finely chopped... mush really. Then do a few bite size pieces of worm and mix the in with the pinky mouse chunks that are already thawed by just sitting there while the worms are chopped. Then present the dish, if your snake it used to hemostats you could used them to move food around in the dish.

Doing this made it so easy to feed my little Radix, Babs. She'll eat anything I mix like that lol

On temperature note of food, I think they almost prefer it cool, seeing as their natural food (worms n frogs n slugs) are cool to the touch. Where as Boas (which you said you've owned, right?) are used hot prey. I used to thaw everything in a plastic bag in warm water but my girl didn't seem to enjoy it at all, never eating much. Now since giving her food that is on the cool side, she's a pig, she loves it!

[Light of Dae]

put it in the dish with little bit of luke warm water,

I should say here, I don't really worry about water temp here, I just use whatever is in the tap, It more likely then not, is quite cold water really. Just be sure it ain't hot water.

[aquamentus_11]

ok, great ideas. can't wait to get home and try them

[EasternGirl]

I have noticed that sometimes my garters do not seem to like the bright UVB light all that much. I try to leave it on for them for a few hours a day so that they get some of the benefits of it...but then I turn it off and just use a basking light...or a regular 40 watt or 60 watt light bulb..depending on what I want my temps to be...if I don't want it too warm for them, I use a 40 watt, if I want it a little warmer, I use a 60 watt and I just monitor the temps on the warm side of the tank...I make sure they stay between 82-86 degrees during the day...and around 78 at night...on the warm side...and around 75 during the day and between 68-71 at night on the cool side.

[infernalis]

I serve cold pinkies. (not frozen, just slightly chilly)

Garter snakes in the wild eat worms, fish and amphibians, when was the last time you ever touched a warm salamander, warm fish or warm worm?

It's far more natural for them to eat cold foods.

[EasternGirl]

I serve them cold too...thawed but not warmed at all.

[aquamentus_11]

I took her out after leaving her alone for a few days and I now think that I may have solved the riddle: that old familiar bluish haze is upon her. I'll wait and see if she normalizes after her shed.

Interestingly, I held up her food dish as I was holding her tonight and she actually b-lined for it. Didn't eat anything of course, but the fact that she thought about eating while being held and shedding was cool. I have a feeling she'll be a little hoglet post-shed.